developing a good bassline

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mrtwister Offline
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developing a good bassline

Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 3:58 pm



OK, our bassline is pretty abysmal. With the exception of 2005, they've played all of their parts unison. Part of this is due to the fact that I'm from a small school and all the talent ends up going straight to snare or tenors in order to fill those spots, and most of the jokers just end up on bass, though, there are like two of them who are pretty good. Does anybody have advice for shaping up the bassline? or am I out of luck? It's quite frustrating, considering our drum tech never even tries to get them to split parts. (i know, he's way more knowledgeable musically than I am, but I just wish that we could at least try to push them to get better.)
you just lost the game lol

Jackson Milton High School

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Capital Regiment Snare 2009


yoshikinto Offline
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Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 4:11 pm



When it comes to splits I think 16th note timing exercises are good


AjaxHammer Offline
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Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 5:43 pm



if they have no motivation to try (you said they were jokers right?) then they should be doing stuff like band.

i think my line does these things where they make different split patterns and name each split a number. while we play 8 on a hand they would play in unison for the first couple of times then the bass caption would yell split 1 or 2,3,4...etc. in the middle of it and they automatically do the split.

im not entirely sure how they do it but thats what im guessing.
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tommyservo7 Offline
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Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 4:09 pm



Sometimes what it takes is for someone on the bassline to step forward and say "we're gonna be a decent bassline this year." They should start out with some simple eighth note spilts, then evenutally (we're talkin' a few weeks) double it up into sixteenth notes (this is where the 1, 2, 3, 4 thing comes in.) Maybe eventually move on to 24th notes (3s) and 32nd notes (4s)
Tom

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yoshikinto Offline
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Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 2:36 pm



tommyservo7 wrote:Sometimes what it takes is for someone on the bassline to step forward and say "we're gonna be a decent bassline this year." They should start out with some simple eighth note spilts, then evenutally (we're talkin' a few weeks) double it up into sixteenth notes (this is where the 1, 2, 3, 4 thing comes in.) Maybe eventually move on to 24th notes (3s) and 32nd notes (4s)
I've never heard triplet 16ths called 24ths. That's wurd


AjaxHammer Offline
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Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 5:39 pm



yoshikinto wrote:
tommyservo7 wrote:Sometimes what it takes is for someone on the bassline to step forward and say "we're gonna be a decent bassline this year." They should start out with some simple eighth note spilts, then evenutally (we're talkin' a few weeks) double it up into sixteenth notes (this is where the 1, 2, 3, 4 thing comes in.) Maybe eventually move on to 24th notes (3s) and 32nd notes (4s)
I've never heard triplet 16ths called 24ths. That's wurd
well it only makes sense because 4 beats of sixtuplets = 24 notes in a 4/4 measure.
Boston Crusaders 2011, 2012 - Snare
Jersey Surf 2010 - Snare
Surround Sound 2010 - Snare


bookreportgrid Offline
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Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 5:59 pm



AjaxHammer wrote:
yoshikinto wrote:
tommyservo7 wrote:Sometimes what it takes is for someone on the bassline to step forward and say "we're gonna be a decent bassline this year." They should start out with some simple eighth note spilts, then evenutally (we're talkin' a few weeks) double it up into sixteenth notes (this is where the 1, 2, 3, 4 thing comes in.) Maybe eventually move on to 24th notes (3s) and 32nd notes (4s)
I've never heard triplet 16ths called 24ths. That's wurd
well it only makes sense because 4 beats of sixtuplets = 24 notes in a 4/4 measure.
no *beep*.

nobody calls them that though.


TheDude Offline
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Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:11 pm



I've heard both Ryan and Scott Johnson call them that. I'm sure they're a lot of other people who call them that too.
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bookreportgrid Offline
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Posted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 12:14 am



rephrase.

Nobody I've ever encountered calls them that.

Doesn't subract from the redundancy of his statement though.


gafoo Offline
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Posted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 1:09 am



most people say 1's 2's 3's and 4's but if you're a true G then you say eighths, sixteenths, twenty-forths, and thirty-seconds.

All joking aside, most good judges will use the proper terminology of naming the subdivision so as to be as clear as possible to what he is talking about on the tape...

I.E.
That was a nice use of the twenty-forth notes in the bass line to counterpoint the sop line.

Also, back on topic...enforce the basics when teaching ANY LEVEL bass line. Let the arranger/caption head worry about the insane split stuff. You can have you basses pair off and work on their own. I have my students carry around the Bassline Bible ( http://parkinglotsounds.com/Bassline_Bible.pdf ). It is written for 2 people (hence the pairing off) with one player playing the parts above the staff and the other playing the parts below. It works the timing of the most common split pattern including splitting sixteenths on the different partials (1-E-&-A). If they can get through this, then they can conceivably play anything the arrange/caption head writes. Of course this doesn't cover the more advanced stuff like splitting 24ths or 32nds but it doesn't sound like your group is ready to tackle that anyway. This piece should be a good jumping off point and like I said, I have my drummer carry it with them everywhere so they can bust out some sticks at any time with one of their bass drum brothers (or sisters) and practice the most fundamental technique of splits.


Snare22 Offline
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Posted: Sun Aug 31, 2008 10:57 pm



im having the same problem with my bassline our 3rd bass is the one thats really struggling, and i was just wondering if you guys have any good bass excersises that will improve their splits, the bass bible was good but i wanted like a whole line legatos or something nothing too hard just to get them thinkin and to get them better as a bass line, thanks PM me if you have somethin good, i appreciate it
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gafoo Offline
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Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 11:58 am



Snare22 wrote:im having the same problem with my bassline our 3rd bass is the one thats really struggling, and i was just wondering if you guys have any good bass excersises that will improve their splits, the bass bible was good but i wanted like a whole line legatos or something nothing too hard just to get them thinkin and to get them better as a bass line, thanks PM me if you have somethin good, i appreciate it
You'd be surprised at how many kids can't even play the first 4 measures without making a mistake! Even if they manage to get it, it's not precise and it's certainly not consistent. And if you can't play simple on and off beats consistently, how are you gonna play them in the context of a legatos exercise which is much harder (space is harder to play right, especially when split among 4-5 people)?
Anyway, I liken the bass bible to the whole philosophy of "crawl before you can walk" style teaching. During the summer I spend the couple of weeks of rehearsal having the bass line play unison only as we go through down beats and up beats as well as 16th note timing stuff (1-and uh, 1 e and, 1 e - uh, - e and uh) making sure to get the feet locked. Then we spend another couple of weeks with only the bible and I make them live and breathe those 2 pieces of paper. After those 2 weeks, then I feel like they are ready for an actual legato split and when I hand it to them, without fail every year, they learn it quickly and are playing with the battery 1s, 2s, 3s, and 4s within minutes of seeing it.
Most teachers let their students get away with sub-par playing at the learning stage which sets them up for failure later down the road. When they are learning new concepts, demand excellence from them by taking it slow enough that they can give you excellent playing. Then build upon that excellence SLOWLY. Crawl before you walk.


ladysnare Offline
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Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 3:29 pm



"The Bass Bible" who is that by? I have never heard of it where can I get it?


gafoo Offline
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Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 3:33 pm



ladysnare wrote:"The Bass Bible" who is that by? I have never heard of it where can I get it?
you win the reading comprehension award...


http://snarescience.com/forums/viewtopi ... 4137#14137


Cadets_Is_For_Lovers Offline
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Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 8:13 pm



i lloks at bass bible and that covers splits

but its good to have a bass line with chops
try and get them to play the snare exercises clean as unisons and youll be in real good shape


gafoo Offline
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Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 9:29 pm



Cadets_Is_For_Lovers wrote:i lloks at bass bible and that covers splits

but its good to have a bass line with chops
try and get them to play the snare exercises clean as unisons and youll be in real good shape
That's an excellent point.


ladysnare Offline
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Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 10:26 pm



"you win the reading comprehension award... "

Nice, I except. lol


gretch89 Offline
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Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:29 pm



tommyservo7 wrote:Sometimes what it takes is for someone on the bassline to step forward and say "we're gonna be a decent bassline this year." They should start out with some simple eighth note spilts, then evenutally (we're talkin' a few weeks) double it up into sixteenth notes (this is where the 1, 2, 3, 4 thing comes in.) Maybe eventually move on to 24th notes (3s) and 32nd notes (4s)
The key to a good bassline is to make sure your drummers work well together. There's nothing better than a TIGHT Bassline. It's also a good idea to have a section leader who can keep everyone going even when your not there.


Bassguy Offline
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Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 1:33 pm



Speaking of working well together, check this out. I'll admit that after the past couple of years, the Cadets have started letting me down. But the Holy Bass makes a good point in this video. It kinda brings back that want to march for them in the future.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnvG4CVQ ... annel_page


optsyn Offline
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Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 2:34 pm



Perfect those check patterns.


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